From Mark Steyn at The Corner… and I tend to agree:
As I wrote back in the summer, “Put not your trust in Blue Dog Democrats.” It was folly to bet the Republic on the likes of Ben Nelson and Blanche Lincoln and other “moderates” who are, by definition, trimmers and accommodationists.
By contrast, Barney Frank and the more ambitious Dems are thinking long-term. And, if it’s a choice between getting government health care or keeping Ben Nelson, it’s no contest. Not to keep quoting myself ad nauseam, but as I said to Hugh Hewitt a couple of months back:
I think the administration is willing to take the hit. In other words, to get health care, they would be willing to reduce their majority, and perhaps even lose their majority in the House and the Senate, because they know it’s a game changer. Now to sell that to individual Senators and Congressmen, you’ve got to have something up your sleeve for them… There are strange elements in play here. But they’ve factored into the whole business a potential, I think, a potential significant loss in the year 2010, in next year’s elections.
I’ve been saying for a year now, in NR and NRO, that the object for savvy Dems is to get this thing passed in whatever form because, once you do, there’s no going back. Kim Strassel in yesterday’s Journal gets it:
So why the stubborn insistence on passing health reform? Think big. The liberal wing of the party—the Barney Franks, the David Obeys—are focused beyond November 2010, to the long-term political prize. They want a health-care program that inevitably leads to a value-added tax and a permanent welfare state. Big government then becomes fact, and another Ronald Reagan becomes impossible. See Continental Europe.
Congratulations all you affirmative action voters, Buckley, Kathleen Parker, and RINOs, Minnesotans, et al. We may be permanently screwed — how does it feel to be responsible for the end of the Republic as we know it? You were told not to vote for this idiot. I’m sure there may be other ways to kill this thing, but the clock is running out.
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Jim Webb may be waffling. And if someone doesn’t show to vote it’s done.
Go to NRO to see the artical on Webb.
1. We’ve already gone over the ways this may be derailed in the Senate.
2. The for-sure game-changer would’ve been the Public Option or Medicare Buy-In. Those are dead.
3. The method that they have now to get to government healthcare is more roundabout and wasn’t their preference.
4. We have until 2014. They may get what they want for now, but this may be a game changer for both sides. The reason government programs are so hard to remove is catalyzing the political will to remove them.
5. This meme of a game-changer has been put forward, no matter what the final form of healthcare was going to be.
6. If we accepted inevitability, the American Revolution never would’ve happened.
Dan you keep telling us it’s not. You’d be wrong but write a novellength
reply. Sigh…….pessimist are as bad for us as the left is. You just keep it up
thoughand suck the wind out of everyones sails Chicken Little.
At least David is workng to stop it. What are you doing? Either help us
or sit back let those of us get the job done.
And quit posting this stuff, Floyd. We already get what the implications are. No need to remind us.
David, in the politest of terms, shouldn’t you be poaching someone else’s material right now?
Not your blog-space, brudda. Floyd can post as he sees fit, and apparently you needed a reminder.
Can we back up a second?
You’re right. It’s not my blog. I’m sorry I didn’t make it request, but I didn’t think my comment was that strongly worded.
This same point has been posted several times, with lengthy discussions following each one. Is it really doing anyone any good to rehash this, as this time? No, it isn’t my call to make, but am I the only one with raw nerves on this issue?
So, why the barb? Am I wrong to make the comment/observation on a blog I frequent so much? I certainly agree that I could’ve said it differently, but you didn’t need to “remind” me. Just ask me to apologize. I’m willing to admit when I made a mistake.
We ain’t done yet. If Joe stays lost Reid SOL !
is there not the small possibility that the SCOTUS may be able to render this thing unconstitutional if challenged?
not that that we should rely on that of course, but I keep hearing arguments that this whole thing is unconstitutional from the get-go.
There is more more than one line that can be taken with this legislation on constitutional challenges.
Also, a different view on D-care, with a quote:
Here’s the thing, the amount of rage present in the electorate and the energy of the Tea Party movement are likely beyond what we saw in ’94. The Democrats are likely setting themselves up for a massive slaughter. Right now, the Dems are down to 218 “likely” seats to stay in their possession, giving us 317 in play. That’s 40 short of a of a 2/3 majority. There are 36 seats in the Senate up for re-election, counting two special elections in January. We need 26 to reach a 2/3 majority there. If we gain a 2/3 majority in both Houses, we can override a presidential veto. You also need 2/3 in both Houses as part of the process to amend the Constitution.
The Dems strategy depends upon the intractability of government programs, but that intractability depends upon a division of the electorate to prevent the solidification of political will to remove it, through the necessity-urgency-dependency strategy. D-care hasn’t fulfilled two of those (necessity and urgency) and likely won’t fulfill the third for some time. This creates a window of opportunity to repeal, assuming that the political will is present to do so.
Mark Steyn is a prophet on this topic, as I believe he is a prophet on the idea that culture is center-left not center-right.
The passage of any health care “reform” bill out of the Senate means a bill signed by Obama and the camel’s nose, if not the whole effing head, for a Euro-style, single payer, national health insurance in America. All the GOP can do is 1) a form of “me-to-ism,” in the sense of mouthing the Left’s talking points that reform is needed just not so much, and 2) relying their opponents to stop the bill. Belief that the latter puts me in mind of a sports analogy, wherein the Chiefs go into a game against the Colts with the strategy of relying on the Colts receivers to drop passes so the Chiefs will win. I know it ain’t a perfect analogy – what with politics being the “art of compromise” and all (which means that Republicans compromise and Democrats eventually get the big gov’t program they want). Still, the “me-to” strategy in the face of a “just win, baby” strategy has been an absolute loser for the “me-to” crowd.
And David, I honestly have no idea what you’re talking about with this “necessity-urgency-dependency” stuff. Any examples from the recent past where the majority party created an entitlement in the face of minority opposition, and the “political will” materialized to repeal it? I can’t think of any. The idea that Republicans, which created the massive prescription drug “entitlement” will suddenly find the “political will” to actually repeal another “entitlement” strikes me as pure fantasy.
But, Lord, how I would love to be proved wrong.
Read this at FoxNews.com:
“At its core, the legislation would create a new insurance exchange where consumers could shop for affordable coverage that complied with new federal guidelines. Most Americans would be required to purchase insurance, with federal subsidies available to help defray the cost for lower and middle income individuals and families.”
Good luck on finding the political will to repeal that.
There is only one way to fight power, and that is with more power. As much as I love and take part in the Tea Party protests (I’d really be out of my mind if it weren’t for these), they just don’t have the power in a center-left America.
That would be unconstitutional Dan. You cannot force
people to buy insurance. In fact I intend to test it if we this shite sandwich
shoved down our throats. And Steyn is wrong. This is a center right country.
You keep telling yourself its a center-right country. No doubt, what remains of the conservatives in England tell themselves the same thing.
About forcing to people to buy insurance. Every state in the nation forces drivers, under penalty of law, to buy automobile insurance. Of course the rationale is different. That is meant to protect others. But since the gov’t has long since established that “the People” not capable of taking care of themselves (Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, etc., ad nauseum), “the People” must now be forced to protect themselves. It’s for their own good, dontcha you know?
Now if you want to argue that feds can’t do what the states are doing already … Hmmm … well, best of luck in finding a judicial panel that will reinforce your arguments with case law.
What about Robert Byrdbrain?Will they have to drag his corpse in to vote?
Democrat admits most Americans opposed Medicare in ’64-’65. ” ‘You know what the poll numbers were on Medicare?’ said Amy Klobuchar (D-Minn), saying that most people were against Medicare when it was first approved.”
Hmmm … I wonder where that opposition is today. … cue crickets.
McCain on health insurance reform: “Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) says that Republicans will “probably not” be able to stop the passage of health care this week, but that his party will continue to “win the battle of American public opinion.”
Screw public opinion. I’d prefer a victory that actually … you know … limited the scope and reach of the federal government.
At least someone is reporting the graft that is allowing this monstrosity to move forward.
Payoffs for states get Harry Reid to 60 votes.
It is amazing what a billion here and a billion there will buy these days.
Dan you are an pptmstic guy. You’d make a saint want to kill
themselves. Stop it.
Stephanie, No.
Oh yeah you are. You’d make JP2 suicidal.
The thing to remember is that the sheer weight of the massive deficit spending and, now, this porcine “reform” are – in the familiar critique of the enviros – UNSUSTAINABLE! Unless the left, somehow, becomes “financially responsible” (pigs taking flight, being far more likely) we are likely to see a double dipping in the economy that will make the “Great Depression” seem like the good ol’ days.
Don’t think the public’s going to be buying the “it’s all Bush’s fault” line, when all this hits the fan, either. Unfortunately, it will be only when we’ve gone OVER the precipice that the “center left” shift will come to an end.
If you say so.
The Democrats were playing chicken with the public on this one and weren’t going to swerve. If it wasn’t buying off Nelson, it would have been budget reconciliation, which would have set an even worse precedent. The Senate was a huge obstacle, but there’s still conference committee, where this crap sandwich will inevitably get larger with pork given the Nelson payoff – more blue dogs will want more graft. Lets see them swallow it.
For all the rhetoric of how the Republicans were becoming a geographically exiled party, the Democrats essentially told every rep. not on the coasts or Boulder they are nothing but cannon fodder in their chess game of government and societal re-invention. I want to see a liberal, with a straight face, tell a conservative they are shoving their morals down their throat after this one. The public is against this deal 2-to-1 and they are passing it anyway. This is the largest bill ever passed along party lines.
I have a hard time believing the individual mandate gets through the Supreme Court, not with the Court in its current form. That probably isn’t enough to tank the whole deal, but we’ll see. If they can get 60, we can. In the words of a recent book, “If you beat them bad enough, they can’t cheat.”
Instead acting like it’s a done deal let’s see what happens. Don’t sell
Webb short here. And David let us know if Lieberman is found. We ain’t done
yet.